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Post by Dave on May 12, 2004 18:05:00 GMT -5
in the future, iv thought of using this type of engine
(hope to find another) as a stationary generator.
weld up a custom frame, like a kubota style system.
rad, eletric start, a guage panel, trailer tonge to be hualed, towed around etc.
im curious if it would reguire a gearbox of some sort.
or run a large powered generator straight of the crank?
directly coupled...
anyone have any input on this??
I think these types of engines would be perfect.
I'll never forget that hot week, in ontario where we had a black out last summer, that lasted for 4 days witout power form (mind you we had small inverters for fans,lights,tv,dish) ;D
the mazda engine could run for days and days on just
a few gallons, they dont hafta rev high, infact maybe even @ high idle to produce several thousands watts of 120 ac. (thinks of the air conditioning)
Dave
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Post by Davotoo on May 12, 2004 19:30:55 GMT -5
I'm in the middle of making a free 3 phase 7 and 1/2 HP motor generate the third phase at 220 by adding a capacitors and turning it with 220 single phase. Be nice if you could just drop a fan belt down to one of these and just roll it under the truck. We do have that spare pully on the crank........ If I had to make a portable I think I would get a VW engine (Lots Lighter). Heard they will idle all day an 1 gallon of #2 Fuel oil. 38 HP will get you about 15KW of power. I owned a 38 HP International multifuel that cranked started on gas an switched to diesel WW2 surplus generator. Weighed in at 4000 pounds. Had the same engine as a D-8 Cat Dozer known for cracking heads if didn't idle them down fo a while before shuting them down. I was only 38 HP but at 1800 RPM.  BTW: I emailed you some more Perkin 4-135 pix....... |
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Post by Dozer on May 13, 2004 11:49:58 GMT -5
I own a few of the gas over diesel engines. The tractors they were used in were the td-6, td-9, td-14, td-18, td-24. They also were used in the wd-9 wheel tractor and some others were built as power units and carried a ud serial # ud-9 for example. 38hp should be the 9 series engine. They are a blast to play with.
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Post by Dave on May 13, 2004 21:18:14 GMT -5
hey Davo, you must be talking about an induction generator. its where you basicly take an electric ac motor turning it faster than its rated output rpms say 1785, you rev it at the 2000 mark roughly if its a 1/2 hp motor it'll generate a good amount of power. but the thing iv been told you cannot use an induction motor to turn another electric motor of equal size. ill get back to you on that, just getting ready to settle in for the night (god its hot today)  btw, this website maybe be of interest to u... www.otherpower.com/otherpowerfront.shtml |
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Post by Davotoo on May 14, 2004 10:05:49 GMT -5
Yea: your right about running other motors, they have to be 1/10 the size of your generator. This guy made a $10 lawnmower set that will run 1090 watts of lights from a Sears 1 hp induction motor. www.qsl.net/ns8o/Induction_Generator.htmlThe salvage yards are full of 3 phase 7 to 10 hp motors down here. Now the caps that another story. We got some on e-bay 100 Mfd @370 VAC for $7.50 each...... |
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Post by Dave on May 14, 2004 18:03:36 GMT -5
u can add other sizes, in series, paralell etc.. but its not very tidy or neat looking... "a cobbled up mess" but good for testing... all you really want is a way to excite the field for a fraction of a second... thats it.. evena 9 volt battery will work to excite the field. a quick flick of a small battery while its spinning.... just dont leave it on too long  |
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Post by metromustang on May 22, 2004 19:52:15 GMT -5
How about building a frame? In this frame would be two rollers about 2" diameter and 2 feet long and spaced 6" between centers. At one end of the rollers you could attach the drive feature (v-belt pulleys, chain sprockets) of your choice and mount the generator to the frame to be driven by these rollers.
Then when you need to run it, you would just drive one of the rear wheels up on it and let it idle in the gear of our choice.
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Post by Davotoo on May 23, 2004 9:36:47 GMT -5
Yea: Then we could use it to dyno tune our rides! ;D
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Post by LoveLearn on Dec 27, 2004 5:51:17 GMT -5
Just another take on this question which has already generated several responses. First of all, understand that good design requires that you do NOT drive a generator through a gear box. Each loaded gear in the drive train converts roughly 1.5 percent of input power to waste heat plus the loaded gears are inappropriate failure points. Direct in-line loading is the only good choice. So given that you should be loading the generator directly, engine rpm must equal generator rpm. Two common CPS standards apply to most countries you're likely to visit. The US grid standard is 60 cycles per second while 50 cycles per second is common in some other countries. For purposes of this discussion, I'll assume you intend to use this generator in the US, but you can multiply these rpms by 5/6 to get 50 cycle equivalents. There are three commonly seen generator winding configurations. The cheapest are 2 pole generators. For them to produce 60 cycles per second, they must spin at 60 cycles per second which is 3600 cycles per minute or 3600 rpm. More expensive generators typically have 4 pole windings. They produce twice as many cycles of AC output as their spinning rate, so to make 60 cps AC output, they need to spin at 1800 rpm. The next higher grade of generators have 6 poles. Not surprisingly, they need to spin only 1200 rpm to make 60 cps output.
Now, at which of these rpms would you you like to spin your Mazda engine for really extended periods, 3600, 1800, or 1200? That's one consideration. Naturally, at 1200 rpm, it will have a fantastic service life if not overloaded.
Why the concern about overloading? That requires addressing various engine rating standards. The longer the required mean time between overhaul, the higher the rated output can be. Take a marine rated engine which may be expected to be subjected to a complete overhaul every 2,000 hours. There is a marine rated version of the Cummins turbo diesel 4-cylinder 3.9 engine factory rated as capable of producing 250 horsepower. But that same size Cummins turbo diesel applied to applications where much longer service lives and available heat sinking is not as robust, 150, 140, 130, 120, 105 and some lower ratings have been applied by the factory. How long is an engine to run without a break to lower output running for a short while before resuming heavy continued loading? All these give different ratings. I've studied them for these 4BT Cummins turbo diesels because I have a couple and have considered doing things that their ratings might define as abuse. I like to make informed choices when I abuse expensive equipment and as a result I RARELY induce a failure. Perhaps we can find Perkins ratings for service use like powering a generator for their 4-135 engine at each of these rpms. That would give you your rational upper load limits for each of these rpm choices.
We don't have the BSFC (brake specific fuel consumption) map for our 4-135 engines, but that would allow us to make REALLY informed choices. I speculate that you would be best served to load this into a 4 pole generator at 1800 rpm. If you do this, never continually load it heavily enough to induce continually visible exhaust turbidity. That would be a clear indication of overloading for that amount of intake air. If you wanted more output at that rpm, you could carefully explore boosting intake air pressure. I expect writing or calling Perkins technical support would give you some useful guidelines although you should expect their responses to be very conservative.
In their position it is safer to error on the side of caution.
If you make that inquiry and get a useful response or if anyone finds a copy of our Mazda diesel engine performance curves or BSFC map, please post news of that availability here so we can share the information. I have curves on more than a hundred diesels and would love to add data on these engines if they are available. This answer to your question is necessarily incomplete, but it points you toward appropriate research. I'll look for ratings of the Mazda/Perkins in the Nebraska Tractor Tests data reports. That is a wonderfully useful standard data source for many diesel engines and it would not surprise me to find Perkins 4-135 listed among existing test reports in some tractor. Also, these engines were sold in fork lifts in the US market and have an excellent reputation for reliability in that service.
John "LoveLearn"
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