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Post by 1983b2200diesel on Mar 15, 2015 19:55:16 GMT -5
My truck is real smoky on startup. 121,000 miles. I've got a manual glow plug relay and even if I hold the glow for a good minute and use my block heater, it's got a faintly blue tinted whiteish grey smoke. It doesn't smell like antifreeze, and the engine has absolutely no leaks or drips. It definitely smells like oil and maybe unburnt diesel. One tech told me it could be from oil leaking past the valve seals, which I have not been able to locate yet the part after a brief search. Another tech told me the valves might need adjusting. Another tech told me my piston rings could be making not a very good seal, but after pulling the oil cap, there is no noticeable blowby. What do you think, how can I fix it?
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Post by gradyc on Mar 15, 2015 21:43:09 GMT -5
If you have been holding the glow button for a minute you most likely have burned the glow plugs out. They say 12v on them but they are really 6v glow plugs so they will heat fast for quick starts. When the automatic system is working it puts 12v to them for a maximum of 6 seconds and then switches the power to them in series through the intake heater to keep them hot without burning them out. That would be the first thing I would check. In the future DO NOT hold the button more than 10 to 15 seconds.
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Post by DieselDangerRanger on Mar 16, 2015 13:52:54 GMT -5
I agree with gradyc they are fried. Makes a big difference on cold starts as I saw when somehow I fried mine. Oops. It's the difference between starting or not up here. You know for certain when removed, booster cable clamping the body to the neg. terminal of the battery. THen, touch the terminal to the positive side. They should start to smoke immediately if working.
For me it's 3sec on then 3 sec off for a period somehow relating to the temperatures.
I'm wondering if it might be safe to put the lowered voltage relay in effect while the engine is running with no alternator cut-out wiring, if that's even what is happening. May be some sort of propane injection could replace the embarrassing cold smoking.
Nice truck, BTW.
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Post by 1983b2200diesel on Mar 17, 2015 17:47:07 GMT -5
Thanks for the compliment danger ranger! I love it to pieces. Built the box myself. And thank you both for your responses. I could really use the help, ha.
So you think that all 4 of my plugs could be bad? Cause they still glow great, BUT it takes em 30 seconds to get there. They all have about the same resistance, but I'll check em again. I wonder if all 4 of the plugs are just the wrong type? I will try to find a p/n on em.
Btw, every morning I have to hold the glow plugs for 35 seconds and she starts up evvery time, but with a 50 foot by 50 foot white, slightly blue tinted cloud . What's weird, is that before, it used to only take me around 15 seconds with the auto glow. Then one day the auto glow stopped working. I pulled out the plugs and tested them individually, took around 15 seconds to glow orange and burn off any residue, hooked directly to the batt with jumpers. But with all 4 plugs hooked up, it takes around 30 seconds to glow orange. I had one glow plug burn out and I replaced it with what the auto store guy said was a match, but I do notice it sits about 2mm higher in the head than the others. I used a heavy duty relay to join the two big wires that came from the auto glow plug relay next to the wiper motor, that's how I did my manual glow. And come to think of it, I haven't messed with the other glow plug relay.. I was such a noob barely knew what I was doing.
Oh yeah, another possible cause of the smoky startup: One tech told me the PCV valve could be letting oil into the cylinder. I've also got a butterfly valve rebreather that I'm a little suspicious of. I'll have to see if it's actually closing, cause every time I look at it it's open. Does that sound plausible? Honestly I haven't worked on the truck since I started my diesel tech program but I could start poking around if I could narrow down some possibilities. But if you give me an idea of something to check for I will report back.
"I'm wondering if it might be safe to put the lowered voltage relay in effect while the engine is running with no alternator cut-out wiring, if that's even what is happening. " No comprende, amigo. Que?
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Post by wayne83 on Mar 17, 2015 19:07:43 GMT -5
If your glow plugs take 15 seconds to get red hot there probably the wrong glow plugs. And also if the terminal on the top is anything different than a threaded stud, its probably the wrong one as well. Someone tried threading a 6.2 glow plug in mine with a spade terminal on it. Luckily they only got it to thread in a few turns so i was able to re tap the whole and put the proper glow plug in it. 1 bad glow plug on these engines is very noticeable, at least on my engine it was, as there was only one 6.2 glow plug in it but it was hard to start, then after putting the correct glow plug in that cylinder it started fantastic from there on out. The factory motorcraft plugs will glow red hot in less than 5 seconds hooked to a battery. If you have the correct plugs and they take that long to heat up, there probably bad. With the correct plugs(when using the motorcraft zd2 glow plug, I cant attest to the NGK Y107R or the Beck Arnley 1761046 how long they would take) I would never hold the button longer than 6 seconds, as that is how long the factory glow plug system sends 12 volts to them, and then 4 to 5 votls after that once the engine is running, then shutting off completly once the engine reaches 86 degrees or the vehicle is under way. The glow plug light on the ranger will only ever stay on 3 seconds no matter how cold it is, im not sure about the mazda, but if you listen at 6 seconds you can hear the relay clunk and thats when the voltage drops to 4 to 5. There is no pcv valve on these engines, just the breather tube from the valve cover to the intake. There is a valve cover mod you can do, just do a search for it on this forum and its pretty simple. The mazdas have the butterfly deal in the intake but the rangers dont, so i have no idea how the butterfly works or why its there on the mazdas.
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Post by gradyc on Mar 18, 2015 1:57:11 GMT -5
If you hooked your push button to the relay that sends power to the intake heater first and then the glow plugs it would take a lot longer for them to heat up. That would make it less likely to burn out the plugs but they might not get as hot. So far I haven't found any info about the intake butterfly. It only came on the Mazda versions and is vacuum operated, and since the engine doesn't create vacuum until it is running it can only close after the engine is started. Diesel engines use amount of fuel injected to control speed not the amount of air so it isn't needed for speed control. I don't know of any practical use for it.
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Post by ol83rangerxlt on Mar 18, 2015 10:18:35 GMT -5
The blue smoke is an indicator of motor oil in the cylinder. On the first startup the smoke is whitish-blue, your valve seals are leaking a little oil into the cylinder before the next start. If you have whitish-blue smoke continuously while traveling then it is usually your rings are broken, or worn, cylinders and rings are worn. If the smoke stops shortly after startup, then it is your valve seals.
MY glow plugs are 12v. On a cold 20 degree morning I hold the GP button for 10 seconds and hit the starter and it cranks on the first turn. I continue to hold the GP button for another minute before releasing it. This allows the cylinders to warm-up a little. After about another minute I press the GP button and hold it for another 30 seconds, and continue to alternate for about 4-5 minutes, or until I am satisfied the engine will run smooth without the GPs. I've had no problems with this method.
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Post by tempforce on Mar 22, 2015 8:03:12 GMT -5
if the engine is cold, the engine will have white smoke, until the cylinders get hot enough to burn the fuel... if after the engine is warm that same smoke will be black. as its unburnt fuel. the blue tint in the smoke could be some oil from valve seals, rings, ect. or if you put some additives in your fuel... on my ranger the after glow works whenever i'm under 7 miles per hour or with the clutch engaged.until the engine is 160'f. the mazda system has a butterfly valve on the intake. supposed to help prevent after run, if the engine starts to use motor oil. this prevents engine run away..
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Post by 1983b2200diesel on Mar 23, 2015 4:39:36 GMT -5
Hey thanks so much you guys. ol83rangerxlt, thanks for that info, that is reassuring b/c I was worried about the rings. It does NOT smoke when running, or on a warm start. There is no black smoke, only thick, light white smoke. So I'll say it's most likely leaky valve seals, and all 4 wrong glow plugs installed.
I can't find valve seals, anybody have a source?
How would I test the butterfly valve on the intake? When is it supposed to shut?
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Post by widetrack212 on Mar 23, 2015 22:02:11 GMT -5
when I bought my head gasket set it came with only 4 valve seals and they wouldn't even work, I had one that was damaged so I made my own out of a plastic clutch pedal bushing from autozone lol..
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Post by DieselDangerRanger on Mar 27, 2015 21:50:50 GMT -5
If you hooked your push button to the relay that sends power to the intake heater first and then the glow plugs it would take a lot longer for them to heat up. That would make it less likely to burn out the plugs but they might not get as hot. Not a push button. A two position momentary on (on-off-on). It is wired to the two original solenoids but I am afraid to trigger with the alternator spinning for fear of burning out my limited supply of GPs. The point of this would be to have a manual sort of 'after-glow' so that smokiness could be kept down while warming up. Soot on the snow, not so nice. I'm not sure how I managed to burn the one set out but I did and these were 11v and I believe that is also what I am running now. The resistor seemed to drop battery voltage down to about 5 or 6v at the glowplugs. May be this would be more like 7-8v with the alternator spinning? But then why would the controller have interupted the alt field circuit? We don't need any solenoids, really. I did fine with a high-amp push button switch wired straight up. I wasn't falling asleep at the switch that often so it was workable. But I've come ahead now with less risk of shorting in the cab and the music of two solenoids working at the flip of a switch. It is possible that I may even have the possibility of a working controller system in the future. But it may be I'll remain happy with things arranged in the manual-assist configuration. First, when I ran veg oil, I had manual three port valves and I got to wrap my head around the whol thing because I had to be certain I wasn't going to ruin things. I liked having this pre-qualifier before I was allowed to move on to electric solenoid valves. We should earn our heated seats and such. Because the reality is not everyone in the world should drive a car or truck.
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Post by William on Jun 29, 2019 8:41:28 GMT -5
Hi I just bought a ford ranger 1983 2.2 Perkins and am looking for rings I don't know ware to find them dose anyone have a suggestion? The engine runs and starts but has bad blowby
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