|
|
Post by rangerrattler on Jan 13, 2016 18:22:08 GMT -5
So since getting a new head on my Ranger, I've fixed a mysterious water-loss problem and she's running great..except for one thing. I think I've lost power. She smokes just like "before" but pulls over the hills even worse than ever. Or at least I think. Startups happen really nicely, albeit just a tad rough when less than 50 degrees outside. Cloudy white smoke turns to black just like she should, and little cranking is required. Top speed is about 65, and it seems at that point that things are getting pretty sketchy. I rarely take her over 60 on long downhill runs. In the past, It'd certainly be able to go about 65 comfortably. Now? Not so much.
I just can't seem to think of why we've lost power, though. The only obvious answer I can come up with is timing, but if the injector timing would need adjustment, why would something as minor as a newly "not cracked" head make a difference? Or perhaps could the newly rebuilt head been done "better" or differently than the original (all was done was valves ground) one when it was on there?
The other thing that has me doubting that it is about timing is the fact that the smoking is exactly how it always had been, and that the startups happen so nice and quickly. If the injector timing is off, would the engine be able to start up so cleanly?
Thanks for any thoughts!
B
|
|
|
|
Post by rustytruck on Jan 13, 2016 19:33:57 GMT -5
the first time I put my IP back on my b2200 after resealing it I was 180 degrees out. Still, it fired right up, smoked like crazy and had no power but it did drive.
|
|
|
|
Post by Rattlerranger on Jan 13, 2016 20:08:04 GMT -5
the first time I put my IP back on my b2200 after resealing it I was 180 degrees out. Still, it fired right up, smoked like crazy and had no power but it did drive. IP? Injection pump? Mine never came off during this fix process. I am wondering if I need to re torque the head bolts(don't think it got done warm, nor was the valve setting, but can't remember) and maybe recheck the valve settings too. Might that be an issue? Thanks |
|
|
|
Post by rustytruck on Jan 13, 2016 21:13:46 GMT -5
yeah nevermind then. You mentioned timing in the first post so I assumed you had the injection pump out for some reason.
Shouldn't have any timing issues if all you did was pull the head, unless somehow you were able to move the pump by accident.
Have you checked the compression after the head swap?
|
|
|
|
Post by ol83rangerxlt on Jan 14, 2016 12:50:23 GMT -5
Maybe the timing has been off all along?
|
|
|
|
Post by rangerrattler on Jan 14, 2016 12:56:29 GMT -5
yeah nevermind then. You mentioned timing in the first post so I assumed you had the injection pump out for some reason. Shouldn't have any timing issues if all you did was pull the head, unless somehow you were able to move the pump by accident. Have you checked the compression after the head swap? No that might be a good idea though  |
|
|
|
Post by rangerrattler on Jan 14, 2016 12:58:57 GMT -5
Maybe the timing has been off all along? Well, I don't think so, as it was running very well a couple years ago and my mechanic friend and I went through the process of trying just a degree or two move a few times..only to go back to our original setting, for the most part. The more I think about this, the more I believe I need to simply go through the head bolt torque re-set with a warm engine, in addition to a valve setting check. I've got to get that guy back out to the shop |
|
|
|
Post by fatguppy on Jan 17, 2016 10:54:01 GMT -5
It kind of sounds like the valves might be just a little on the tight side. Ok when cold, but as the engine warms up the clearance decreases and they don't seal properly. I think you're on the right track with the re-torque and checking the valves.
|
|
|
|
Post by wayne83 on Jan 17, 2016 19:43:06 GMT -5
When I had my head re-done and new bearings/rings in the engine I drove it about 1000 miles before re checking the head bolts and valves. I did as the manual says warm the engine and check head bolt torque and to my surprise every one of them was "loose." I didn't check what torque they were at, but I know I got about 3/4 of a turn on the torque wrench before it clicked on every one of them. As far as power wise I did notice a little bit of difference but nothing to significant as it seemed terribly slow to me without the turbo on it at that time. The turbo went right back on once I re-made the exhaust manifold so I could put A/C on it. So I would agree, defiantly check the head bolt torque with the engine warm and adjust the valves and go from there.
|
|
|
|
Post by montana on Jan 17, 2016 21:09:09 GMT -5
I would echo the sentiments of the others, re-torque the head bolts and re-adjust the valves.....seems like small potatos but it can make a huge difference......keep us posted.
|
|
|
|
Post by rangerrattler on Jan 18, 2016 15:03:04 GMT -5
I appreciate all the responses, guys..just to be clear, though, I've re-read the other thread here where it was debated whether to adjust valves cold or warm and I'm stumped. Which is it!??
I am a bit confused as to how they'd end up too tight if done cool (FatGuppy). I'd think they'd be too tight if done warm. Wouldn't it be the opposite? I'm not educated enough on how valves and lash works, so I'm scratching my head, can somebody explain this a little deeper for me to feed my curiosity?
Mechanic friend coming over tonight..thanks!
|
|
|
|
Post by montana on Jan 18, 2016 16:29:53 GMT -5
I've always adjusted my valves warm, I believe that's also what the factory service manual states. If adjusted cold the valves can be too tight as a result of metal expansion after the engine reaches operating temp.
|
|
|
|
Post by dieseldawg on Jan 18, 2016 19:30:34 GMT -5
I appreciate all the responses, guys..just to be clear, though, I've re-read the other thread here where it was debated whether to adjust valves cold or warm and I'm stumped. Which is it!?? I am a bit confused as to how they'd end up too tight if done cool (FatGuppy). I'd think they'd be too tight if done warm. Wouldn't it be the opposite? I'm not educated enough on how valves and lash works, so I'm scratching my head, can somebody explain this a little deeper for me to feed my curiosity? Mechanic friend coming over tonight..thanks! Found this on another site, but might prove useful after reinstalling head and the engine is cold. Here's a blurb from the Crane website: Compensating for a Cold Engine when Adjusting Valve Lash When installing a new cam, the engine will be cold but the lash specifications are for a hot engine. What are you to do? There is a correction factor that can be used to get close. We mentioned that the alloy of the engine parts can be affected by thermal expansion in different ways, therefore the amount of correction factor to the lash setting depends on whether the cylinder heads and block is made out of cast iron or aluminum. You can take the “hot” setting given to you in the catalog or cam specification card and alter it by the following amount to get a “cold” lash setting. With iron block and iron heads, add .002” With iron block and aluminum heads, subtract .006” With both aluminum block and heads, subtract .012”. |
|
|
|
Post by dieseldawg on Jan 18, 2016 19:33:29 GMT -5
Sorry for the double post
|
|
|
|
Post by rangerrattler on Jan 19, 2016 0:23:30 GMT -5
Well it appears that .002 off wasn't my problem, lol. The valves were all screwed up. First, though, we tightened almost all head bolts up from 78 or so at least a quarter turn (some over half a turn, so might have been below 80) up to 85 lbs. Great. That was easy. We found TDC easily with the pointer and mark. That's slick. The lash was off on a couple of the rockers over TWO .025 testers stacked on top of each other! My mechanic and I both were scratching our heads, but he assumed that he'd probably done the adjustment "cylinder by cylinder" (and I don't think it changed things all that much because they were cold) back when it was done over a year ago. I certainly don't remember having gone through this procedure like this last time, but then it has been quite a long time (it was idle for a long time because of my electrical/starting issues ) Holy Toledo. Well, I guess too loose is better than too tight. But wow. So I had a good notion that things would be better upon startup. Yes. The motor was MUCH quieter and purred along nicely. I couldn't believe how shocking it was when it first started, it was so quiet. I felt stupid, though. I should have realized how much rattle there was going on. Hopefully driving like this for 4-5 tankfuls hasn't done any damage to the valves. But yes, in retrospect, she was really smoking too much. The power and response and lack of smoke is excellent. It's still a dog going up a steep hill, but 3rd gear is much stronger and she holds power at low revs better. And up at 55, she's got a lot of juice to go to 60 and over pretty quickly now. That's definitely the power sweet spot at that speed. Great to have this done. Again, thanks for your encouragement, guys! Now it's time for a steering&suspension&wheel bearing makeover to try to get rid of this right hand turn shimmy I can't seem to get diagnosed |
|
